@lucybeahere @JimmyB @gpilz @Thebratdragon
I don't think this is about the inability to comprehend that there are gradations of evil in the world. I think this is at least in part the moral decision that some people take that they simply will not vote for ANY evil.
In other words sometimes the choices are so onerous they are impossible to make. If someone were to say "take this gun and kill one of your two children and if you don't kill one of them we will kill both", what would YOU do?
@Dave_Goldsmith @JimmyB @gpilz @Thebratdragon
I already made the terrible choice, as endless people have done before me when voting (or choosing not to). Someone is going to get elected, and whether we vote or not, we are responsible for that result. I don’t know of a president that doesn’t have blood on his hands, that was a “pure” choice. Bc even the blessed Jimmy Carter had that burden to bear, ie funding and arming Indonesia and the genocide of East Timor.
@lucybeahere @JimmyB @gpilz @Thebratdragon
I agree with you; Carter & E. Timor is a good example of your principal of imperfect leadership.
Where we differ is your contention that voting or not voting makes you equally responsible for the actions of the leader of your country, especially in the U.S. when the popular vote winner loses the election.
I don't beleive for a moment that the people who refused to vote in sham Russian elections, for example, are as responsible as Putin's supporters.
@Dave_Goldsmith @JimmyB @gpilz @Thebratdragon
Russian elections truly are a sham. No one else can be elected except Putin. Here, we had a choice. Voting and not voting actually did affect the result. Which is why many people are so passionate about it, and why there is voter suppression and election interference. If it didn’t matter, no one would bother. Democracy is so valued that people attempt to run for office in
Russia, even knowing they can’t win and it will likely get them killed.
@lucybeahere @JimmyB @gpilz @Thebratdragon
Yes here we have a choice. Usually it is a choice between two pro-capitalist, anti-environmentalists. I guess you think voting for the lesser of two evils is essential. I tend not to think that way and evidentally the majority of eligable voters agree with me. I think our elections are closer to Russian and Iranian on the "sham spectrum" than are the elections in true multi-party democracies like in Western Europe.
@Dave_Goldsmith
The majority of voters decided to vote. Because as we are already seeing, voting matters. It is not nearly as free and fair as it should be, but it’s not a sham. That’s why people are still voting, and putting up various ballot initiatives that also prove voting matters. States that have decriminalized marijuana and abortion, for a couple examples. Voting in the local elections as well. It’s so important. I can see why many get discouraged, but it all matters.
I believe the majority of eligible voters chose once again NOT to vote in 2024.
Yes, voting matters, just as your response or lack of response to ALL forms of coercion matters.
You think its wrong to abstain from voting because you think voting for the lesser evil is essential. Other people think acquiescing to any evil is immoral. I understand both perspectives and I don't tell people they are wrong either way they chose.
@lucybeahere
> The majority of voters decided to vote.
Trump picked up ¾ million more votes than what he had in 2020. Kamala lost ~10—11 million votes that previously went to Biden in 2020. Taking this math into account, 9+ million decided not to vote (which surprised me b/c voter reg surged when Kamala announced she was running).
The conversation here is fixated on Palestine. But it seems to be widely accepted that voters #1 issue was the economy. Kamala lost votes because people were not convinced that she would improve the price of eggs and oil (or whatever) over Biden.
Dems are lazy as fuck voters. But I am surprised that the threat of a Trump POTUS was not in itself intense motivation to vote. But it turns out selfishness prevailed and the *perception* that Trump would be better for jobs and inflation (the very same reason Hitler got elected… the nazi party was seen as being better for jobs).
@bojkotiMalbona This just illustrates how uninformed the sheep are or STUPID, more than willing to undermine every value the country was founded upon, placing their hopes on corruption for a ‘better’ outcome, apparently unaware or don’t care about the threat to their liberties. Or maybe a sizable number are racist little fucks and the appeal of a smooth talking flim flam robber was just so appealing. They loved cheering his hate. As a team the USA is failing. 😓
@bojkotiMalbona @lucybeahere @Dave_Goldsmith
Many of those votes were not lost through apathy, but through active suppression.
